It is not "the West." It is only the monster-owned MSM.
Ukraine hasn't been lucky in the last 100 years, but it is also an artificial country, with half of it belonging to ethnic Russians. Not that it matters; both of them are falling prey to the technocrats' ruse.
Not quite. "The Ukraine" in Russian means "the hinterland" or "the outskirts." The two languages are mutually intelligible. Ukraine has been part of Russia ever since Russia existed. The differences of the dialects resemble the differences between Czech and Slovakian.
The rulers of neither of these people have been very nice to their subjects in history, but that can be said about most rulers. The problem is that nationalism, since 1789, has been exploited towards a simple change of rulers. No matter who rules, the simple person ends up with the shorter stick...
I understand that (parts) of Ukraine have been connected with Russia for centuries. My question was, where do you think that stick is shorter? Do you think that the 'simple person' in Ukraine would rather live under Russian control?
But it's not that simple, and not all parts of Ukraine, with Eastern Ukraine being part of the Russian Empire (not Russia). Western Ukraine was part of the Austro-Hungarian Empire, and only became part of the USSR in the 20th century.
It's true that both countries trace back to Kievan Rus', which was actually ruled by ethnic Scandinavians. But they went their separate ways for a few hundred years.
I'm sure that the Ukrainians really loved being under Russian/Soviet 'control', and want to return. Would you?
I admit to having been sloppy; indeed, there is still a Hungarian-speaking minority in Western Ukraine. FYI: the language has been banned in education since Ukraine became "independent," so oppression was not limited to ethnic Russians...
It doesn't matter whose control it is; what matters is whether the rulers care for the people or not. After Stalin, mass murders were stopped in the Soviet Union. The country, however, was not exactly a paradise for free speech and living standards. Still, the shortages were evenly distributed, ethnic Russians were not any better off than anyone else. In fact, the satellite states cost too much, so the Russians were happy to let them go after 1991.
Don't fall for the scam. Putin is a member of the group of monsters. Nobody is a "good guy" here; not that any such thing has ever existed beyond the realm of fairy tales.
Right, sure. But given that there is no good guy, is it at least fair to say that Putin's behavior is looking increasingly justified and Russia's conduct continues to be weirdly aggressively misrepresented?
Someone has to be president of Russia, and their job is advancing Russian interests, not anyone else's, within the general rules of the international community that Russia chooses to be a member of.
Putin is not a madman, he is not the aggressor here, and he is not behaving irrationally. NATO and the CIA's puppet in Ukraine left him with no good choices. He knew how an invasion would be portrayed, and he tried to solve the problem diplomatically for years. Russia was promised that NATO would get "not one inch" closer to Russia's borders. There were 16 member states of NATO at that time.
In the coming years, 14 more states were admitted to NATO, all of them from former eastern bloc countries. Each one brought NATO closer to Russia, and all but five of them happened while Putin was president of Russia.
I don't like Putin particularly. He's an autocrat, a tyrant, a kleptocrat, and a butcher. He is not a good guy. In this conflict, he's being set up so that the CIA and the rest of the globalists can justify NATO's expansion and eventually remove Putin him from power, since he's not willing to bend a knee before them. It's all about the great reset.
Putin and those of us who oppose the globalist agenda have a common enemy. He may not be a good guy, but neither was Stalin when the US allied with him in WWII.
My post was a reply to one where Guttermouth expressed chagrin at the idea of thinking she was "pro-Putin." I wanted to express that I am in the same place she is with regard to not believing the legacy media's propaganda meant to make us support Ukraine and hate Putin, but it does not mean I am pro-Putin either.
There are shades of gray and nuances in life, and things are not neatly black and white. People have a tendency to see things in terms of one side being "the good guy" and the other being "the bad guy," and that's simply not a realistic way to see the world.
Many Americans have romanticized Zelenskyy and demonized Putin, like how one of Ronald Reagan's sons called Zelenskyy "the Ukranian Reagan." I expect that kind of thing from the globalist propaganda of the legacy media, but a lot of people who are COVID skeptics are buying into this whole "Putin is a madman" story.
It would be more accurate to call Zelenskyy "the Ukranian Putin," as both are corrupt kleptocrats, except that the tyrant Putin actually fights for Russia, while the tyrant Zelenskyy sold his country out to the globalists in the west, for the specific purpose of setting Ukraine up to be mauled by the bear.
I too have been surprised to see so many who saw through Convid get caught up in the Ukraine hysteria. Some of it I attribute to generations of hate-Russia Cold War propaganda having seeped deeply into the psyches of so many in the so-called free US states, where also many Covid skeptics are.
And that's why NATO made sure Putin would have little choice but to do what he did. They're a relic of a cold war that ended 30 years ago... what good are they if there is no Soviet Union to fight? So they rattle their saber, make it clear that they can't tell the difference between Russia and the former USSR, then keep provoking him and encroaching on his country until they finally get the response they were looking for.
It took a lot longer than they probably expected, and certainly a lot longer than it would have taken to provoke the US into war if we were in Russia's place, but they got their wish. The last piece of the puzzle that remained was then for the globalist media to portray this as an unprovoked act of aggression on Putin's part, which they have done. Now the cold war relic that should have disbanded in 1991 has all of this newfound relevance, and the cold war that NATO and the CIA loved so much (both were created to fight it) is back on again.
I'm not sure that Putin agrees with you, and is as excepting as you are about the end of the Cold War. He sure doesn't acknowledge other countries borders.
Please, understand that this is a theater and Putin and the clown are actors. The goal is to divert people's attention from the genocide with injections, 5G, and chemtrails.
It's actually to engineer economic chaos, food shortages in the bread basket of the world, energy inflation and blatant economic pain to move the masses in the west toward the 'sustainable' green scam agenda. Putin is no longer moving the pieces on the board he was told. He may implement much of the great reset technofascism domestically in Russia (Vaxes, QR madness, facial recognition), but he's not in their corner anymore. He's on the counter offense with a gold and commodity backed ruble that will be the downfall of a nothing backed petrodollar, and already out maneuvered much of their sanctions which is why they're using this "genocide" to engineer more, which will only equal more intentional economic pain and chaos in the west.
Also, combining a WHO tyranny with "carbon credit" through UBI will ensure full control over the leftover drones.
Gold-backed sounds nice (and Gadaffi was eliminated for the offense of planning that), but wait until gold is collected from everyone as it happened in the US during the Great Depression. Once you cannot own gold, it has no value. Moreover, one cannot eat gold, so commodities will keep up a balance among the "rulers."
Not quite a puppet; more like an ally (for the time being, but the monsters will kill each other, too, in the end, because they know they cannot trust each other and only One can rule), but yes, these "events" have been planned for decades and the show is a red herring.
All major countries have biolabs, developing bioweapons (the one in Wuhan, apparently, assisted with the development of the lethal injections), but the only things they have developed on a large scale are incurable poisonings with anthrax and smallpox. At this point, the technocratic poisoning with 5G and graphene oxide/hydroxide are not even strictly-speaking bioweapons.
The US taxpayer is borrowing money at an interest from the Federal Reserve and the money is being distributed among friends and family. That's been the case since 1913. The taxpayer has no freaking idea about the dark investments in his name.
Why does it appear that democrats, socialists and the crossbread democrat-socialists are always the provocateurs of conflict, war and death?
US civil war
Mexican American war
Spanish American war
WWI
WWII
And after Orwell's prescient book, the proxy conflicts have all (for the most part) moved to the disputed territories outside Oceania, EastAsia and Eurasia.
Where the uniparty Rinos didn't want to left out of the party so they've danced around the pig's head a time or two.
Korea
Viet Nam
Bosnia
Somalia
Iraq
Congo, Sudan and Ethiopia
Afghanistan
Syria
Libya
Ukraine
Will we ever learn, or just keep ineffectually culling the herd, hoping for a better (brave new) world (order)?
Sure, but without writing a three volume dissertation on geopolitical conflicts over the past 200 years, here are some notes:
US civil war - slave dependent democrats
Mexican American war - James Polk, democrat, and "manifest destiny".
Spanish American war - US interventionism in a local civil war (the budding progressive movement both democrat and misguided republicans)
WWI - Prussian socialists, and American democrat admin that involved the US
WWII - national socialists and fascists, and FDR (and neoliberal UK and French) admin that looked the other way until too late.
Korea - ChiComs (and inept democrat manipulation of a proxy war)
Viet Nam - ChiComs, with democrat manipulation of gulf of Tonkin false flags
Bosnia - Balkanization movement fostered by liberal socialism that amplified tribalism (and a very long history of horrible democrat-socialist ideals applied the the region for a few thousand years)
Somalia-half assed American involvement in more tribalism and manipulation of warlord factions
Iraq - the defense contractor paid politicians fostered the "let's give them weapons" mentality from the 70's screwed up the Middle East that eventually got the US involved, several times.
Congo, Sudan and Ethiopia - more funneling of weapons to warlords by recipients of defense contractor's "donations" (democrats and RINOs alike)
Afghanistan - RINO bushies and indecisive Obama culminated with Biden's disaster. It was one thing to hunt down bin Laden (who was supplied weapons and cash for decades by the US until they lost control of their attack dog), and entirely another with the protracted debacle trying to westernize a near Stone Age culture with cash, weapons, technology and western liberalism
Syria - Putin, Obama, EU
Libya - Obama/Clinton
Ukraine - Putin, US neocons, US democrat socialists, you know, commies......
Note, it isn't always the initial "aggressor" that's holds all the blame, and it's frequently the misguided responses by indecisive "leaders" that is the cause of the greater disaster.
I indicated it already in 2002 that if I wanted genocide, I would do it with "vaccines," then new "vaccines" that would complicate and simplify certain things.
I also pointed out that WW3 would probably break out on TV without a shot ever fired. After all, Eurasia and Oceania must be in perpetual war in order to ensure martial law.
Everybody, the Chinese, the Russians, and the West are in the club.
The rest of it is a theater, which will work as long as people believe in "viruses" and "infectious diseases." After the covid theater, it only stands to reason.
There is a multipolar world now, which is part of the theater, but it's increasingly difficult to engineer coordinated theatrics for globalist interests in a multipolar world. Which is why they're clearly trying to topple Putin and assumed China wasn't already in his corner when they shared intelligence with the dragon only a few months ago... which China hilariously went and shared with Russia. There's a reason Soros, Schwab, and the neoliberal globalist technofascist in power across the west hate Putin. We are at war with them (they declared it on us/humanity) and so the enemy of my enemies (Sun Tzu) still stands.
Eventually, all the genociders will become enemies to each other. However, at this point, they agree to take full control over their populace, which is why they are on the same team for the time being. "We" are posing as much danger to them as a sip of wine after supper or, a fly circling around a bull's ass. (Ray Horvath :) )
Apr 5, 2022·edited Apr 5, 2022Liked by Good Citizen
Respectfully, I still need to dig further. But I have a different -- and to some, more callous -- point to make. Zelenksy armed the civilian population, effectively conscripting them. Little to no training, improvised weapons (the explosives), and so on. The Western media celebrated these actions -- which only a very very few dissenting voices pointed out could be understood quite differently under the Geneva convention. Likewise, the MSM celebrated stories of civilians poisoning Russian soldiers with cake, and other acts of "resistance."
But during the first few weeks of the war, it was apparent to all observers that Russia was targeting Ukraine's military capacity. NOT the civilians. MSM even reported this -- now down the memory hole. Russia was not fighting a war of attrition or terror against the civilian population. Russia was intentionally not targeting the civilian population.
Okay. Here is my point. If you conscript your civilians to fight soldiers who were not previously targeting your civilians, you had better expect increased casualties -- including deaths -- among your civilian population. I have no idea about the truth concerning Bucha. Meaning, I certainly do agree with you that we must critically and cautiously evaluate the MSM accounts and government statements. But more civilian deaths were a given -- because of the very policies and practices that Zelensky implemented and the MSM unconditionally celebrated.
Zelenksy sought and still seeks to use his civilian population as a shield. He is not defending them or even Ukraine -- he is defending his regime. Our power elite want his show to continue -- seemingly at any price.
For example, when Tulsi Gabbard called for a cease-fire, a halt to Russian and Ukraine military actions so that the pathogenic "research materials" could be secured, our MSM pundits and social media shills denounced her as a "treasonous liar". Stop or pause the war just to prevent potential massive casualties to the people of Ukraine and the region? Absurd! Unthinkable! Treason!
And on it goes. FYI, I do discuss the Pentagon Fact Sheet on the Ukrainian biolabs. This will not apply to your readers: but if anyone still doubts these labs existed or that they contained bio-terrorism level pathogens, feel free to send them over.
All best. You just delivered an important and even courageous check to the MSM consensus -- to both the manufactured consent and the engineered moral panic. You might be a target for some blowback soon enough.
"Okay. Here is my point. If you conscript your civilians to fight soldiers who were not previously targeting your civilians, you had better expect increased casualties -- including deaths -- among your civilian population." Exactly, great point! But Bucha still appears to be staged. Videos are surfacing of soldiers in civilian clothing laying down on the side of the road. One of them moves his hand out of the way of a passing truck. When the camera pans forward we see in the rear view mirror a civilian move from fetal position to his knees. More theater from the comic and his handlers. Performative "war crimes".
I think your analysis of the scene is excellent. I'm not disputing the possibility, or even the probability. Sorry if I what I said gave any other impression. I'm just hoping we get more actual information, and not more MSM bullshit.
I remember the Anthrax attacks in 2001 being blamed on Iraq. MSM had "hard evidence", etc. It was an American biodefense scientist using a "sample" from Fort Detrick. Took years for that to finally be established. Collin Powel's speech before the UN Security council. Widely praised performance -- justification for the Second Iraq War and global War on Terror. Within one year, all his "facts based on solid intelligence" -- his allegations about Iraqi WMD were thoroughly debunked. Matter of record, Senate investigation and more. Still, brilliant performance. Graphics and all. Our Secretary of State lied to the world, publicly. But the MSM loved it at the time. And the list goes on.
More recently: we have the recent 50 intel professionals claiming Hunter Biden's laptop was Russian dis-info: after professional journalists like Glenn Greenwald and others had verified it. We had the Steele dossier, based on alleged Russian intelligence but instead was Clinton Foundation dis-info. We had General "Righteous Strike" Milley confirming the "secondary explosions." Who knew that when you kill innocent children in a drone strike, you get secondary explosions? Now we know. For whatever reasons, the NYT had a brief lapse back into journalism. For which I do thank them. Etc.
Yes, it's the same old CIA/MI5 pattern with their mockingbird media screaming their lies and the assimilated unthinking masses allowing themselves to be outraged. It never ends. Incubators, Anthrax, WMD, Syria Chlorine Gas, and that's just the past thirty years. Everything is a dis/mis information psyop. "Solid intelligence sources say..." "Sources say..." "Pentagon sources say..." after a while one is either a moron or they hear those words and immediately become suspicious. [But your point about arming civilians, I think with 10,000 Kalashnikovs around Kiev is excellent]
They did claim a maternity hospital was attacked in Ukraine. And when they did, I immediately had the same flashback.
On the same general issue, it also turned out that the Kuwaitis WERE slant-drilling, tapping into the Iraqi oil fields. Ha ha ha. One of the complaints that the USA and April Catherine Glaspie blew-off. Glaspie was Ambassador to Iraq from 1980 to 1989, and did help support Iraq in its wars against Iran.
Knowing that Iraq had massed troops on the border with Kuwait, Glaspie's remarks to SH were seen as a greenlight: "We have no opinion on your Arab-Arab conflicts, such as your dispute with Kuwait. Secretary Baker has directed me to emphasize the instruction, first given to Iraq in the 1960s, that the Kuwait issue is not associated with America."
Go get 'em, tiger!
I do feel sorry for any foreign leader foolish enough to trust us. Like, study some history, dude or dudette.
Exactly. Not only that but whatever civilians were killed there in white armbands may have been killed by UA commandos. Bring in the cameras. Blame it on Russia.
Contravening evidence
One clip published and later deleted by Ukrainian military commander Sergey Korotkih showed Ukrainian troops in Bucha discussing engagement rules. Korotkih, formerly a citizen of Belarus, is an open neo-Nazi who went to Ukraine back in 2014 to fight in the ranks of the notorious Azov Battalion. In Russia, Korotkih is wanted on multiple murder charges.
One of the fighters can be heard asking if it was OK to shoot at “guys not wearing blue armbands” identifying Ukrainian soldiers. The response was an affirmative “you bet”.
Some of the civilians apparently killed in Bucha were wearing white armbands. Russian troops had reportedly asked all civilians to wear them to identify themselves as non-combatants.
As I'm sure you know, not being able to confirm that something happened, is not the same as confirming that something didn't happen. So I guess that is a kind of luminous test: You can come to whatever conclusion you already decided.
I'm sure that you will amend your conclusion as new information is released - right?
Not sure if you are replying to my comment or the Good Citizen's or both. I can answer for myself, however. If fact based evidence and not just word of mouth is presented, I would consider a change of opinion and conclusion. How about photos for one. In the modern world everyone is on the phone. Have seen none of the actual event going down, just photos of the aftermath. How about a joint U.S. and Russian investigation? That is never considered, but then neither side can twist the narrative, if they are working together. I for one, will always change my opinion if true facts are brought to light.
Linked a video today from Sputnik News showing the Ukranian forces driving down a street with the so-called dead bodies. Several things stood out:
A) All the victims appeared to be in sleeping positions.
B) They were evenly spaced along the road ( kind of unusual for a random massacre ).
C ) They all appeared to be young men ( Ukranian soldiers perhaps?) - no women or children.
D) Very little, if any, visible blood or mangled body parts.
Also one part of the video shows one of the "dead" waving his hand, must be one of the walking dead I guess and another part of the video shows someone starting to stand up in the side mirror of one of armed forces vehicle after it had passed him.
I watched that dead man waving his hand. So sloppy it's embarrassing. or maybe they're shooting a new walking dead season in Bucha with Sean Penn directing.
Pelosi is rumored to be putting together the numbers for new
“Walking Dead Equity Agenda”:
with guaranteed voting privileges, priority for all future flagged events, with special recognition of those with visible disabilities, and free transport to US: “If we can’t take care of our actors in this crisis it could be a threat to our democracy. Slava Ukraine!”
Speaking of Penn. Hannity had him on his show tonight. What a farce, He must be the new go to expert. Hannity is a joke as well. He's just the other side of the propaganda coin. Heads you lose, tails you lose. The only one left that raises any questions at all in any of the MSM is Tucker. Then again, they could just be using him to play everybody!!!
I've yet to see the MSM talk to anybody that knows jack about what's going on in the Ukraine and there are so many in the alt media, that they wouldn't have any trouble finding accurate analysis of what's going on. But then they would be reporting the truth and we know that isn't going to happen.
The images I've seen show bodies with two things that tell me UA Azov hit squads did the killing. 1. white arm bands 2. Russian food rations. Russian forces asked civilians in the area to wear white arm bands so they could be recognized as non-combatants, and before departing handed out boxes that are uniform Russian food aid. When Azov arrived in the area their mission was to clear the area of hostiles including civilian 'colluders'. The images across western rags are live persons posing in the fetal position on the side of the road. One of them moves their hand. Another moves to his knees. A horrible C rated propaganda production. Russia invited UN observer to investigate, UA and Britain said no. SBU + Mi6 operation. It's the same as always but you are free to believe western propaganda if you want.
I'm sorry if I not as believing of Russian propaganda as you are. I can send you information regarding the famous moving hand 'facts', if you want.
BTW, who is the 'Foundation for the Study of Democracy', whose study you cited? I see that the authors are also members of the 'Civic Chamber of the Russian Federation'.
If you prefer western propaganda that's fine, just come out say so without making accusations of those who question it believing in Russian propaganda. I'm not Russian, have no dog in this fight other than exposing the lies that are incessantly flowing from the west that are believed without skepticism or question. Why would Ukraine and Britain refuse an independent UN investigation that Russia called for? What does Russia gain by slaughtering civilians? Cui bono? Have you asked the simple question of who benefits here?
There are international processes for getting the facts from events that occur in war time that are challenged by two sides. It worked in Syria (proving chemical attacks were staged), Iraq (WMDs never found) but the west doesn't want that here, why? I suspect the reason is (based on pattern, repetition, history) that things didn't exactly occur as the UA government claims. As for war crimes in Donbas, if you don't believe a genocide happened there over the past eight years committed by UA with the help of the CIA, that's on you. If a source I use has an .ru domain that doesn't make it Russian propaganda despite what western powers are trying to condition the masses to believe with lazy accusations of "Russian asset" or "Putin stooge" being leveled everywhere to shut up those who dare question their lies and propaganda.
I agree that we must evacuate events with a critical eye. It's interesting that you don't feel any need to question the propaganda coming out of Russia. I didn't question your source, just because it's coming from a Russian source (and my questioning the source doesn't mean that I question the results). I think that it's great that there is a pro-democracy group in Russia, and I would love to see some other research that they have produced (including on the status of democracy in Russia). But excuse me if I am not as excepting as you that this is actually a 'pro-democracy' group. We both know how well 'democracy' and Russia have fit together, and what has happens to those 'who dare question their lies and propaganda'.
As for your question 'What does Russia gain by slaughtering civilians', I can think of a number of things, first among them fear. We both know that civilian deaths is not something that has ever bothered the Russia armed forces.
FYI - UN-based groups have found that Syrian forces used chemical weapons. Can you send me the link to prove that the attacks were staged?
We can start with the evidence that some bodies seen on the video's posted by the Ukrainian forces (beginning of April), were visible on aerial pictures from the march (before the Russian forces left the city).
President Zelensky is a comedic actor, the world is his clown stage. The West indulges him and his farce at the expense of the Ukrainian people.
It is not "the West." It is only the monster-owned MSM.
Ukraine hasn't been lucky in the last 100 years, but it is also an artificial country, with half of it belonging to ethnic Russians. Not that it matters; both of them are falling prey to the technocrats' ruse.
I think it's more the other way around: He indulges the west, playing the role the CIA has assigned to him. He's just a puppet, like Joe Biden.
Not that simple, but it is part of the truth.
Authoritarians are like mold spores, always floating around looking for conditions in which they can fester.
Are you saying that the Ukrainian people would rather be part of Russia?
Not quite. "The Ukraine" in Russian means "the hinterland" or "the outskirts." The two languages are mutually intelligible. Ukraine has been part of Russia ever since Russia existed. The differences of the dialects resemble the differences between Czech and Slovakian.
The rulers of neither of these people have been very nice to their subjects in history, but that can be said about most rulers. The problem is that nationalism, since 1789, has been exploited towards a simple change of rulers. No matter who rules, the simple person ends up with the shorter stick...
I understand that (parts) of Ukraine have been connected with Russia for centuries. My question was, where do you think that stick is shorter? Do you think that the 'simple person' in Ukraine would rather live under Russian control?
Ukraine was not "connected." it was part of Russia.
When it comes to simple people, their end of the stick is always shorter. It is not "Russian" or "Ukranian" control. It is simply CONTROL...
But it's not that simple, and not all parts of Ukraine, with Eastern Ukraine being part of the Russian Empire (not Russia). Western Ukraine was part of the Austro-Hungarian Empire, and only became part of the USSR in the 20th century.
It's true that both countries trace back to Kievan Rus', which was actually ruled by ethnic Scandinavians. But they went their separate ways for a few hundred years.
I'm sure that the Ukrainians really loved being under Russian/Soviet 'control', and want to return. Would you?
I admit to having been sloppy; indeed, there is still a Hungarian-speaking minority in Western Ukraine. FYI: the language has been banned in education since Ukraine became "independent," so oppression was not limited to ethnic Russians...
It doesn't matter whose control it is; what matters is whether the rulers care for the people or not. After Stalin, mass murders were stopped in the Soviet Union. The country, however, was not exactly a paradise for free speech and living standards. Still, the shortages were evenly distributed, ethnic Russians were not any better off than anyone else. In fact, the satellite states cost too much, so the Russians were happy to let them go after 1991.
All my life I have been demonized for being born in Russia, which you'd only know if I told you
Honesty is ridiculed and derided in America
Please write about huntergate lap top dances
How were you demonized, if no one knew?
Um. Guys? This is like the third article today I've read along these lines.
I'm starting to feel, um... pro-Putin.
Talk me out of this?
Don't fall for the scam. Putin is a member of the group of monsters. Nobody is a "good guy" here; not that any such thing has ever existed beyond the realm of fairy tales.
Right, sure. But given that there is no good guy, is it at least fair to say that Putin's behavior is looking increasingly justified and Russia's conduct continues to be weirdly aggressively misrepresented?
Someone has to be president of Russia, and their job is advancing Russian interests, not anyone else's, within the general rules of the international community that Russia chooses to be a member of.
Putin is not a madman, he is not the aggressor here, and he is not behaving irrationally. NATO and the CIA's puppet in Ukraine left him with no good choices. He knew how an invasion would be portrayed, and he tried to solve the problem diplomatically for years. Russia was promised that NATO would get "not one inch" closer to Russia's borders. There were 16 member states of NATO at that time.
In the coming years, 14 more states were admitted to NATO, all of them from former eastern bloc countries. Each one brought NATO closer to Russia, and all but five of them happened while Putin was president of Russia.
I don't like Putin particularly. He's an autocrat, a tyrant, a kleptocrat, and a butcher. He is not a good guy. In this conflict, he's being set up so that the CIA and the rest of the globalists can justify NATO's expansion and eventually remove Putin him from power, since he's not willing to bend a knee before them. It's all about the great reset.
Putin and those of us who oppose the globalist agenda have a common enemy. He may not be a good guy, but neither was Stalin when the US allied with him in WWII.
Thank you. This is an excellent synopsis of where my brain has arrived on this issue.
https://www.lewrockwell.com/2022/04/gary-d-barnett/what-will-you-do-when-there-is-no-food/
“I don’t like Putin, but ...” is becoming the analogue of “I am not an anti-vaxxer, but ...” Why all the throat clearing?
Putin is damaging NATO, the enemy of all humanity. And the Covid jab is poison, like all vaccines.
My post was a reply to one where Guttermouth expressed chagrin at the idea of thinking she was "pro-Putin." I wanted to express that I am in the same place she is with regard to not believing the legacy media's propaganda meant to make us support Ukraine and hate Putin, but it does not mean I am pro-Putin either.
There are shades of gray and nuances in life, and things are not neatly black and white. People have a tendency to see things in terms of one side being "the good guy" and the other being "the bad guy," and that's simply not a realistic way to see the world.
Many Americans have romanticized Zelenskyy and demonized Putin, like how one of Ronald Reagan's sons called Zelenskyy "the Ukranian Reagan." I expect that kind of thing from the globalist propaganda of the legacy media, but a lot of people who are COVID skeptics are buying into this whole "Putin is a madman" story.
It would be more accurate to call Zelenskyy "the Ukranian Putin," as both are corrupt kleptocrats, except that the tyrant Putin actually fights for Russia, while the tyrant Zelenskyy sold his country out to the globalists in the west, for the specific purpose of setting Ukraine up to be mauled by the bear.
I too have been surprised to see so many who saw through Convid get caught up in the Ukraine hysteria. Some of it I attribute to generations of hate-Russia Cold War propaganda having seeped deeply into the psyches of so many in the so-called free US states, where also many Covid skeptics are.
Putin has done more to 'justify NATO's expansion' in the last few months than in the decades since the fall of the USSR.
And that's why NATO made sure Putin would have little choice but to do what he did. They're a relic of a cold war that ended 30 years ago... what good are they if there is no Soviet Union to fight? So they rattle their saber, make it clear that they can't tell the difference between Russia and the former USSR, then keep provoking him and encroaching on his country until they finally get the response they were looking for.
It took a lot longer than they probably expected, and certainly a lot longer than it would have taken to provoke the US into war if we were in Russia's place, but they got their wish. The last piece of the puzzle that remained was then for the globalist media to portray this as an unprovoked act of aggression on Putin's part, which they have done. Now the cold war relic that should have disbanded in 1991 has all of this newfound relevance, and the cold war that NATO and the CIA loved so much (both were created to fight it) is back on again.
I'm not sure that Putin agrees with you, and is as excepting as you are about the end of the Cold War. He sure doesn't acknowledge other countries borders.
Please, understand that this is a theater and Putin and the clown are actors. The goal is to divert people's attention from the genocide with injections, 5G, and chemtrails.
It's actually to engineer economic chaos, food shortages in the bread basket of the world, energy inflation and blatant economic pain to move the masses in the west toward the 'sustainable' green scam agenda. Putin is no longer moving the pieces on the board he was told. He may implement much of the great reset technofascism domestically in Russia (Vaxes, QR madness, facial recognition), but he's not in their corner anymore. He's on the counter offense with a gold and commodity backed ruble that will be the downfall of a nothing backed petrodollar, and already out maneuvered much of their sanctions which is why they're using this "genocide" to engineer more, which will only equal more intentional economic pain and chaos in the west.
That has always been the plan.
Also, combining a WHO tyranny with "carbon credit" through UBI will ensure full control over the leftover drones.
Gold-backed sounds nice (and Gadaffi was eliminated for the offense of planning that), but wait until gold is collected from everyone as it happened in the US during the Great Depression. Once you cannot own gold, it has no value. Moreover, one cannot eat gold, so commodities will keep up a balance among the "rulers."
Spot on TGC.
Something about “foreign entanglements” comes to mind, whatever happened to “that guy”?
Long gone...
Thank you for that.
So Putin is entirely a WEF/whoever puppet and the invasion has no actual purpose than creating media distraction?
Not quite a puppet; more like an ally (for the time being, but the monsters will kill each other, too, in the end, because they know they cannot trust each other and only One can rule), but yes, these "events" have been planned for decades and the show is a red herring.
All major countries have biolabs, developing bioweapons (the one in Wuhan, apparently, assisted with the development of the lethal injections), but the only things they have developed on a large scale are incurable poisonings with anthrax and smallpox. At this point, the technocratic poisoning with 5G and graphene oxide/hydroxide are not even strictly-speaking bioweapons.
The US taxpayer is borrowing money at an interest from the Federal Reserve and the money is being distributed among friends and family. That's been the case since 1913. The taxpayer has no freaking idea about the dark investments in his name.
And I'd honestly be fine with those objectives.
Why does it appear that democrats, socialists and the crossbread democrat-socialists are always the provocateurs of conflict, war and death?
US civil war
Mexican American war
Spanish American war
WWI
WWII
And after Orwell's prescient book, the proxy conflicts have all (for the most part) moved to the disputed territories outside Oceania, EastAsia and Eurasia.
Where the uniparty Rinos didn't want to left out of the party so they've danced around the pig's head a time or two.
Korea
Viet Nam
Bosnia
Somalia
Iraq
Congo, Sudan and Ethiopia
Afghanistan
Syria
Libya
Ukraine
Will we ever learn, or just keep ineffectually culling the herd, hoping for a better (brave new) world (order)?
Can you be a little more specific? Who do you feel was the aggressor for each of the examples you listed?
Sure, but without writing a three volume dissertation on geopolitical conflicts over the past 200 years, here are some notes:
US civil war - slave dependent democrats
Mexican American war - James Polk, democrat, and "manifest destiny".
Spanish American war - US interventionism in a local civil war (the budding progressive movement both democrat and misguided republicans)
WWI - Prussian socialists, and American democrat admin that involved the US
WWII - national socialists and fascists, and FDR (and neoliberal UK and French) admin that looked the other way until too late.
Korea - ChiComs (and inept democrat manipulation of a proxy war)
Viet Nam - ChiComs, with democrat manipulation of gulf of Tonkin false flags
Bosnia - Balkanization movement fostered by liberal socialism that amplified tribalism (and a very long history of horrible democrat-socialist ideals applied the the region for a few thousand years)
Somalia-half assed American involvement in more tribalism and manipulation of warlord factions
Iraq - the defense contractor paid politicians fostered the "let's give them weapons" mentality from the 70's screwed up the Middle East that eventually got the US involved, several times.
Congo, Sudan and Ethiopia - more funneling of weapons to warlords by recipients of defense contractor's "donations" (democrats and RINOs alike)
Afghanistan - RINO bushies and indecisive Obama culminated with Biden's disaster. It was one thing to hunt down bin Laden (who was supplied weapons and cash for decades by the US until they lost control of their attack dog), and entirely another with the protracted debacle trying to westernize a near Stone Age culture with cash, weapons, technology and western liberalism
Syria - Putin, Obama, EU
Libya - Obama/Clinton
Ukraine - Putin, US neocons, US democrat socialists, you know, commies......
Note, it isn't always the initial "aggressor" that's holds all the blame, and it's frequently the misguided responses by indecisive "leaders" that is the cause of the greater disaster.
I indicated it already in 2002 that if I wanted genocide, I would do it with "vaccines," then new "vaccines" that would complicate and simplify certain things.
I also pointed out that WW3 would probably break out on TV without a shot ever fired. After all, Eurasia and Oceania must be in perpetual war in order to ensure martial law.
Everybody, the Chinese, the Russians, and the West are in the club.
The rest of it is a theater, which will work as long as people believe in "viruses" and "infectious diseases." After the covid theater, it only stands to reason.
There is a multipolar world now, which is part of the theater, but it's increasingly difficult to engineer coordinated theatrics for globalist interests in a multipolar world. Which is why they're clearly trying to topple Putin and assumed China wasn't already in his corner when they shared intelligence with the dragon only a few months ago... which China hilariously went and shared with Russia. There's a reason Soros, Schwab, and the neoliberal globalist technofascist in power across the west hate Putin. We are at war with them (they declared it on us/humanity) and so the enemy of my enemies (Sun Tzu) still stands.
Eventually, all the genociders will become enemies to each other. However, at this point, they agree to take full control over their populace, which is why they are on the same team for the time being. "We" are posing as much danger to them as a sip of wine after supper or, a fly circling around a bull's ass. (Ray Horvath :) )
I have lots of questions, but not for this time; instead I will link this now:
https://www.thepostil.com/the-military-situation-in-the-ukraine/?utm_source=sendfox&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=the-postil-april-newsletter
Agreed. Excellent read.
Zelensky the actor and CIA puppet has a new gig with the western authoritarian globalists.
Thank you GC for factual comment. Without bloggers like you, we in the west who support the Russian effort would be without ammunition.
Respectfully, I still need to dig further. But I have a different -- and to some, more callous -- point to make. Zelenksy armed the civilian population, effectively conscripting them. Little to no training, improvised weapons (the explosives), and so on. The Western media celebrated these actions -- which only a very very few dissenting voices pointed out could be understood quite differently under the Geneva convention. Likewise, the MSM celebrated stories of civilians poisoning Russian soldiers with cake, and other acts of "resistance."
But during the first few weeks of the war, it was apparent to all observers that Russia was targeting Ukraine's military capacity. NOT the civilians. MSM even reported this -- now down the memory hole. Russia was not fighting a war of attrition or terror against the civilian population. Russia was intentionally not targeting the civilian population.
Okay. Here is my point. If you conscript your civilians to fight soldiers who were not previously targeting your civilians, you had better expect increased casualties -- including deaths -- among your civilian population. I have no idea about the truth concerning Bucha. Meaning, I certainly do agree with you that we must critically and cautiously evaluate the MSM accounts and government statements. But more civilian deaths were a given -- because of the very policies and practices that Zelensky implemented and the MSM unconditionally celebrated.
Zelenksy sought and still seeks to use his civilian population as a shield. He is not defending them or even Ukraine -- he is defending his regime. Our power elite want his show to continue -- seemingly at any price.
For example, when Tulsi Gabbard called for a cease-fire, a halt to Russian and Ukraine military actions so that the pathogenic "research materials" could be secured, our MSM pundits and social media shills denounced her as a "treasonous liar". Stop or pause the war just to prevent potential massive casualties to the people of Ukraine and the region? Absurd! Unthinkable! Treason!
And on it goes. FYI, I do discuss the Pentagon Fact Sheet on the Ukrainian biolabs. This will not apply to your readers: but if anyone still doubts these labs existed or that they contained bio-terrorism level pathogens, feel free to send them over.
All best. You just delivered an important and even courageous check to the MSM consensus -- to both the manufactured consent and the engineered moral panic. You might be a target for some blowback soon enough.
"Okay. Here is my point. If you conscript your civilians to fight soldiers who were not previously targeting your civilians, you had better expect increased casualties -- including deaths -- among your civilian population." Exactly, great point! But Bucha still appears to be staged. Videos are surfacing of soldiers in civilian clothing laying down on the side of the road. One of them moves his hand out of the way of a passing truck. When the camera pans forward we see in the rear view mirror a civilian move from fetal position to his knees. More theater from the comic and his handlers. Performative "war crimes".
I think your analysis of the scene is excellent. I'm not disputing the possibility, or even the probability. Sorry if I what I said gave any other impression. I'm just hoping we get more actual information, and not more MSM bullshit.
I remember the Anthrax attacks in 2001 being blamed on Iraq. MSM had "hard evidence", etc. It was an American biodefense scientist using a "sample" from Fort Detrick. Took years for that to finally be established. Collin Powel's speech before the UN Security council. Widely praised performance -- justification for the Second Iraq War and global War on Terror. Within one year, all his "facts based on solid intelligence" -- his allegations about Iraqi WMD were thoroughly debunked. Matter of record, Senate investigation and more. Still, brilliant performance. Graphics and all. Our Secretary of State lied to the world, publicly. But the MSM loved it at the time. And the list goes on.
More recently: we have the recent 50 intel professionals claiming Hunter Biden's laptop was Russian dis-info: after professional journalists like Glenn Greenwald and others had verified it. We had the Steele dossier, based on alleged Russian intelligence but instead was Clinton Foundation dis-info. We had General "Righteous Strike" Milley confirming the "secondary explosions." Who knew that when you kill innocent children in a drone strike, you get secondary explosions? Now we know. For whatever reasons, the NYT had a brief lapse back into journalism. For which I do thank them. Etc.
Yes, it's the same old CIA/MI5 pattern with their mockingbird media screaming their lies and the assimilated unthinking masses allowing themselves to be outraged. It never ends. Incubators, Anthrax, WMD, Syria Chlorine Gas, and that's just the past thirty years. Everything is a dis/mis information psyop. "Solid intelligence sources say..." "Sources say..." "Pentagon sources say..." after a while one is either a moron or they hear those words and immediately become suspicious. [But your point about arming civilians, I think with 10,000 Kalashnikovs around Kiev is excellent]
Most times, everyone who picks up arms is counted as 'enemy combatant'.
What? No babies thrown out of incubators and onto the cold floor?
nb4. For you Millennials and Zoomers out there who may not remember 1990.
https://www.bitchute.com/video/v6PfIWzUOpcz/
They did claim a maternity hospital was attacked in Ukraine. And when they did, I immediately had the same flashback.
On the same general issue, it also turned out that the Kuwaitis WERE slant-drilling, tapping into the Iraqi oil fields. Ha ha ha. One of the complaints that the USA and April Catherine Glaspie blew-off. Glaspie was Ambassador to Iraq from 1980 to 1989, and did help support Iraq in its wars against Iran.
Knowing that Iraq had massed troops on the border with Kuwait, Glaspie's remarks to SH were seen as a greenlight: "We have no opinion on your Arab-Arab conflicts, such as your dispute with Kuwait. Secretary Baker has directed me to emphasize the instruction, first given to Iraq in the 1960s, that the Kuwait issue is not associated with America."
Go get 'em, tiger!
I do feel sorry for any foreign leader foolish enough to trust us. Like, study some history, dude or dudette.
I don't question your assertions, but what about the relentless bombing and missile attacks on numerou cities.
I love this amazing club I belong too. Thanks to everyone for your intelligent thinking!
Pentagon can't independently confirm atrocities in Ukraine's Bucha, official says -
Reuters
THAT PRETTY MUCH SAYS IT ALL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
https://www.reuters.com/world/pentagon-cant-independently-confirm-atrocities-ukraines-bucha-official-says-2022-04-04/
Exactly. Not only that but whatever civilians were killed there in white armbands may have been killed by UA commandos. Bring in the cameras. Blame it on Russia.
Contravening evidence
One clip published and later deleted by Ukrainian military commander Sergey Korotkih showed Ukrainian troops in Bucha discussing engagement rules. Korotkih, formerly a citizen of Belarus, is an open neo-Nazi who went to Ukraine back in 2014 to fight in the ranks of the notorious Azov Battalion. In Russia, Korotkih is wanted on multiple murder charges.
One of the fighters can be heard asking if it was OK to shoot at “guys not wearing blue armbands” identifying Ukrainian soldiers. The response was an affirmative “you bet”.
Some of the civilians apparently killed in Bucha were wearing white armbands. Russian troops had reportedly asked all civilians to wear them to identify themselves as non-combatants.
Saw that one as well!!!
As I'm sure you know, not being able to confirm that something happened, is not the same as confirming that something didn't happen. So I guess that is a kind of luminous test: You can come to whatever conclusion you already decided.
I'm sure that you will amend your conclusion as new information is released - right?
Not sure if you are replying to my comment or the Good Citizen's or both. I can answer for myself, however. If fact based evidence and not just word of mouth is presented, I would consider a change of opinion and conclusion. How about photos for one. In the modern world everyone is on the phone. Have seen none of the actual event going down, just photos of the aftermath. How about a joint U.S. and Russian investigation? That is never considered, but then neither side can twist the narrative, if they are working together. I for one, will always change my opinion if true facts are brought to light.
And tell then you have no problem with the Russian propaganda?
‘COMMENTS’ are longer than the post; guess GC touched a nerve.
Linked a video today from Sputnik News showing the Ukranian forces driving down a street with the so-called dead bodies. Several things stood out:
A) All the victims appeared to be in sleeping positions.
B) They were evenly spaced along the road ( kind of unusual for a random massacre ).
C ) They all appeared to be young men ( Ukranian soldiers perhaps?) - no women or children.
D) Very little, if any, visible blood or mangled body parts.
Also one part of the video shows one of the "dead" waving his hand, must be one of the walking dead I guess and another part of the video shows someone starting to stand up in the side mirror of one of armed forces vehicle after it had passed him.
Thanks for some more light on the subject. Will be linking tomorrow @https://nothingnewunderthesun2016.com/
I watched that dead man waving his hand. So sloppy it's embarrassing. or maybe they're shooting a new walking dead season in Bucha with Sean Penn directing.
Pelosi is rumored to be putting together the numbers for new
“Walking Dead Equity Agenda”:
with guaranteed voting privileges, priority for all future flagged events, with special recognition of those with visible disabilities, and free transport to US: “If we can’t take care of our actors in this crisis it could be a threat to our democracy. Slava Ukraine!”
Speaking of Penn. Hannity had him on his show tonight. What a farce, He must be the new go to expert. Hannity is a joke as well. He's just the other side of the propaganda coin. Heads you lose, tails you lose. The only one left that raises any questions at all in any of the MSM is Tucker. Then again, they could just be using him to play everybody!!!
I've yet to see the MSM talk to anybody that knows jack about what's going on in the Ukraine and there are so many in the alt media, that they wouldn't have any trouble finding accurate analysis of what's going on. But then they would be reporting the truth and we know that isn't going to happen.
So the Russian forces did nothing wrong?
If I understand your analysis, nothing happened that would be considered a 'war crime' in Bucha?
No, it probably would be considered a war crime, but they will never investigate it.
I was referring to the Russian's action. But now you're saying that the Ukrainians actions are war crimes?
The images I've seen show bodies with two things that tell me UA Azov hit squads did the killing. 1. white arm bands 2. Russian food rations. Russian forces asked civilians in the area to wear white arm bands so they could be recognized as non-combatants, and before departing handed out boxes that are uniform Russian food aid. When Azov arrived in the area their mission was to clear the area of hostiles including civilian 'colluders'. The images across western rags are live persons posing in the fetal position on the side of the road. One of them moves their hand. Another moves to his knees. A horrible C rated propaganda production. Russia invited UN observer to investigate, UA and Britain said no. SBU + Mi6 operation. It's the same as always but you are free to believe western propaganda if you want.
I'm sorry if I not as believing of Russian propaganda as you are. I can send you information regarding the famous moving hand 'facts', if you want.
BTW, who is the 'Foundation for the Study of Democracy', whose study you cited? I see that the authors are also members of the 'Civic Chamber of the Russian Federation'.
If you prefer western propaganda that's fine, just come out say so without making accusations of those who question it believing in Russian propaganda. I'm not Russian, have no dog in this fight other than exposing the lies that are incessantly flowing from the west that are believed without skepticism or question. Why would Ukraine and Britain refuse an independent UN investigation that Russia called for? What does Russia gain by slaughtering civilians? Cui bono? Have you asked the simple question of who benefits here?
There are international processes for getting the facts from events that occur in war time that are challenged by two sides. It worked in Syria (proving chemical attacks were staged), Iraq (WMDs never found) but the west doesn't want that here, why? I suspect the reason is (based on pattern, repetition, history) that things didn't exactly occur as the UA government claims. As for war crimes in Donbas, if you don't believe a genocide happened there over the past eight years committed by UA with the help of the CIA, that's on you. If a source I use has an .ru domain that doesn't make it Russian propaganda despite what western powers are trying to condition the masses to believe with lazy accusations of "Russian asset" or "Putin stooge" being leveled everywhere to shut up those who dare question their lies and propaganda.
I agree that we must evacuate events with a critical eye. It's interesting that you don't feel any need to question the propaganda coming out of Russia. I didn't question your source, just because it's coming from a Russian source (and my questioning the source doesn't mean that I question the results). I think that it's great that there is a pro-democracy group in Russia, and I would love to see some other research that they have produced (including on the status of democracy in Russia). But excuse me if I am not as excepting as you that this is actually a 'pro-democracy' group. We both know how well 'democracy' and Russia have fit together, and what has happens to those 'who dare question their lies and propaganda'.
As for your question 'What does Russia gain by slaughtering civilians', I can think of a number of things, first among them fear. We both know that civilian deaths is not something that has ever bothered the Russia armed forces.
FYI - UN-based groups have found that Syrian forces used chemical weapons. Can you send me the link to prove that the attacks were staged?
Note: if evidence comes forth to show Russia is guilty of these accusations, I'll gladly retract this piece and make a new one showing their guilt.
We can start with the evidence that some bodies seen on the video's posted by the Ukrainian forces (beginning of April), were visible on aerial pictures from the march (before the Russian forces left the city).